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Topic : What is the problem with the town hall.

midway
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03/10/2014 : 22:27:44      reply with quote


.why are so many groups changing venues. is it just the cost?
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gazzer
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03/10/2014 : 23:08:10      reply with quote


Years of lack of looking after the place ended up with an ill conceived refurb pushed through when many people were warning against it
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UNCLE FESTER
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04/10/2014 : 01:27:15      reply with quote


Time to get them town hall disco's going again Midway, Nothing for the young people of silsden to look forward to anymore, Come on Midway let's try and give the young people somthing to look forward to again once a week, I am willing to fund this one for our young people of Silsden, If any of you young people of Silsden would like a silsden town hall disco once a week drop a message of support and it will happen
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gazzer
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04/10/2014 : 08:10:21      reply with quote


A one off reunion disco with King Ben on the door!!
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phill
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04/10/2014 : 08:25:52      reply with quote


When you say so many groups, who apart from Majorettes? We have booked extra and so has Zumba?
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victor
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04/10/2014 : 09:45:13      reply with quote


About six weeks ago I posted that I was disgusted that the Silsden community productions were going to use the Methodist hall for there next production. As they were one of the main groups pushing for the Town hall refurbishment for there use, I will not be supporting them any more.
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midway
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04/10/2014 : 09:45:50      reply with quote


phill when you say " We have booked extra" does that mean you are responsible for taking bookings at the Town Hall, that you have booked extra time at T,H, or you have taken on extra members to your group.Hasn't the camera club changed venues?
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skippy
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04/10/2014 : 13:10:59      reply with quote


phill were the majorettes not the biggest user group? whoops,also the camera club and one of the theatre groups now moved? money probably is the concern, it will be interesting to see what the turnover is when we ask the question at bfd council meeting.
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phill
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04/10/2014 : 14:43:31      reply with quote


We are a user of the Town hall and are there 5 days including Saturday, great building and happy to see it busy on a Saturday morning including the library, shame more people don't support what is a lovely building and refurbishment. Looking forward to our week long summer schools and getting the kids of Silsden involved. I believe Zumba has also booked another session, good luck to them too.
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midway
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04/10/2014 : 16:33:54      reply with quote


Just remember Zumba is obviously a commercial enterprise, £4 per person pr session, not a bad little earner, no wonder they can afford to pay the hire charges.
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Raver
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04/10/2014 : 17:16:10      reply with quote


In the refurbished Town Hall Silsden has the best community building of any small town/village in the local area.

In the debate leading up to the rebuild I in favour of a new community centre rather than reuse of the old building. But although on the wrong side of the argument I was very pleased when I saw the end result. So I am eating 'humble pie' and saying well done to the team that pushed the plans through.

Others seem to be harbouring petty political grouses and playing the usual 'knocking' games. As a community we should all be now pushing for the maximum use of this brilliant facility. Leading the way should be our Town Council who could set an example by holding their Town Council Meetings in 'their' Town Hall, rather than the Co-op's rest room.
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Rosy Lea
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04/10/2014 : 17:38:57      reply with quote


HERE, HERE Raver. You are spot on!!
The Town Council are a disgrace to us all by not using their own Town Hall.
Pull Your Socks up TC sad :(
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gazzer
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04/10/2014 : 18:01:26      reply with quote


quote
posted by Rosy Lea
HERE, HERE Raver. You are spot on!!
The Town Council are a disgrace to us all by not using their own Town Hall.
Pull Your Socks up TC sad :(
I thought the council chamber and fixtures were removed
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HurricaneHector
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04/10/2014 : 18:04:48      reply with quote


The Town Council can not hold their meetings in the Town Hall, apart from the extra cost, they can not meet the safety requirements.
I would hazard a guess that if some of the groups now using the Town Hall actually read the requirements fully they would find that they can't either?
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midway
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04/10/2014 : 18:38:32      reply with quote


Yes i think there is a problem with our TC using the Town Hall, for example the £35 caretaker charge,but that isn't the same for other groups,as staff charges are included in the hire STAFF CHARGES
1 member of staff is included in the hall hire. Extra members of staff may be necessary if deemed appropriate by the Halls
Manager and are charged to the hirer.
Weekday
£8.40
per hour
Saturday
£12.70
per hour
Sunday & Bank holidays
£16.90
per hou
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skippy
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05/10/2014 : 10:04:23      reply with quote


raver and rosylee you seem to forget we the town council were thrown out of the town hall by the owners ( bfd council)if we were to return and spend the precept on hiring a room in the town hall we would be accused of wasting ratepayers money by some folk so we use the coop meeting room which is adequate for all our needs, it is disabled friendly and free of charge, I would like to ask you to attend a meeting and see for yourselves what a good room this is, the next meeting is on thurs9th oct 7.30 maybe see you there?
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Rosy Lea
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05/10/2014 : 12:12:43      reply with quote


Skippy.
One thinks that you are missing the point. The Town Hall is still our towns building by default and has been the centre focus of activities in the town since it was built. Iím sure the majority of Silsden folk would agree (not "some folk" as you say) that you should be based there even if it cost us a little bit of precept. Lets have a vote happy :)
Itís about time grudges were dropped.
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gazzer
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05/10/2014 : 12:32:32      reply with quote


this post has been edited 1 time(s)

quote
posted by Rosy Lea
Skippy.
One thinks that you are missing the point. The Town Hall is still our towns building by default and has been the centre focus of activities in the town since it was built. Iím sure the majority of Silsden folk would agree (not "some folk" as you say) that you should be based there even if it cost us a little bit of precept. Lets have a vote happy :)
Itís about time grudges were dropped.
Bradford Council closed the old council offices on Wesley Place(sold the building)20+ years ago and moved the chambers to the Town Hall. Its not true that the chambers were in the Town Hall from when it was built.
You should speak to Bradford Council and ask why they no longer provide a dedicated council chamber in the Town Hall free to the Town Council.
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Raver
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05/10/2014 : 13:30:42      reply with quote


Some people are not taking the point of my previous blog.

Yes we had some arguments over a new community facility for Silsden and I did support the alternatives. Yes the TC lost it's dedicated meeting room in the Town Hall refurbishment. And - oh dear - hasn't that 'safety' argument become a little tired?

But this is all in the past. The case for the Town Hall refurbishment prevailed and now Silsden has probably the best community facility of any local town/village.

Time for everybody, with the leadership (!) of our Town Council, to encourage the Town to make the fullest use of this great asset. An outsider might think that there is an unofficial boycott in place to stop using the Town Hall to perpetuate a silly political argument......surely not!

But - yes - I do agree that BMDC should allow our Council to use their Town hall with no charge - shouldn't our District Councillor's be able to arrange this? However, even if they fail, then it's no big deal if the TC is making a payment which will contribute to the community facility.

Now that we have the facility lets all work together to make it a success!

Time to draw a line over the past differences and move on!
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phill
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05/10/2014 : 15:27:40      reply with quote


Think a lot of people hold your views but are afraid of conflict. We will support the town hall now and in the future and hopefully bring in new business at weekends...onwards and upwards.
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gazzer
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05/10/2014 : 17:03:18      reply with quote


this post has been edited 1 time(s)

quote
posted by Raver
And - oh dear - hasn't that 'safety' argument become a little tired?


I work in the building trade and if an occasion arose where I thought it would be cheaper to not stick to building regs do you think the Bradford Council building inspectors let me cut corners like they let Bradford Council.
Dont forget the whole project had 2 factors. 1,Council cuts(closing library) and 2,Petty politics of one man because a Town Councillor beat his mate in a Bradford Council election.

It is time to move on but it wont because a Councillor has stated he will never talk to/with the Town Council.


Back to the thread, IF people are jumping ship then what is wrong with the Town Hall?
solid wood flooring

Rosy Lea
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05/10/2014 : 19:49:08      reply with quote


What would it take to oust this councillor and get our TC back into the centre of our community?
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gazzer
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05/10/2014 : 21:42:29      reply with quote


quote
posted by Rosy Lea
What would it take to oust this councillor and get our TC back into the centre of our community?
Cant "oust" him, not if you believe in democracy.
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victor
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06/10/2014 : 11:07:37      reply with quote


Rosy Lea I think you are on crossed-purposes, gazer is talking about Andrew Mallinson a Bradford councillor elected this year for a three year term, and you are talking about Silsden Town Council who are co-opted as there are not enough people putting there names forward so as to require an election.
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GAMEKEEPER
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06/10/2014 : 12:11:38      reply with quote


quote
posted by Rosy Lea
What would it take to oust this councillor and get our TC back into the centre of our community?
Silsden Town Council could not be more focused on the community if they tried! Each ;and every councillor puts time and effort into the community as a whole.

The issue with the former Town Hall is that it is still not DDA compliant, despite having £400,000+ thrown at it. The true spend on the hall, as far as I am aware has not yet been disclosed. As someone stated in an earlier post, Bradford want to charge ALL users for the use of the former town hall. The Town Council do not have a budget for this.
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Rosy Lea
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06/10/2014 : 12:42:46      reply with quote


Oh dear...But democracy will prevail, iím sure.
Please can everyone stop talking in cryptic as it is very confusing.
My husband and I attended a Bradford Council Meeting at the TH I think two years ago now and our Mayor refused point blankly to even stand up and address Mr Mallinson, man to man, in a civil manner.
We were disgusted and think our Mayor and councillors were out of order. If they canít even stand up and represent our community as a figure head of responsibility and lead they way then they should bow out.
Nobody is perfect...but we felt that attitude stunk and demonstrated insular communicative difficulties within our community. Ok the TH isnt appropriately compliant, so what...it is our understanding that it wasnít before either. If there isnít a budget available we will pay for the first meeting at the TH...whose next? Lets fix our community Now.
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Peter
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06/10/2014 : 13:21:37      reply with quote


quote
posted by Rosy Lea
Oh dear...But democracy will prevail, iím sure.
....Ok the TH isnt appropriately compliant, so what...it is our understanding that it wasnít before either. If there isnít a budget available we will pay for the first meeting at the TH...whose next? Lets fix our community Now.
Rosy Lea, it's not so easy as that....

A little background reading news.silsden.net/archives/46

Silsden Town Council could hold meetings in the Town Hall and the hire of the room would be free, BUT, the refurbishments have now enabled a group of people (those in wheelchairs and people who cannot not walk up steps) into the town hall.

Council meetings are open to the public and are held twice a month. Being an open meeting STC would have to hire a caretaker to keep the building secure during the meeting and enable the use of the disabled toilet which is on the upper floor. Not too bad if there isn't an emergency because there is a lift. However, for a disabled person on the upper floor, if there was an emergency, the lift could not be used and the only escape is via chair lift - hence the need for a caretaker.

Wheelchair users attending a meeting cannot even get into the town hall if the main door is closed, because there is no wheeelchair access button that can be reached from a wheelchair, and the door does not automatically open sad :(sad :(

I believe the hire of a caretake for two hours is £35, so it would cost STC £70 per month to hold council meetings in the town hall, Why would they pay that when they can hold meetings in the co-op boardroom for FREE. The co-op boardroom is on the ground floor, the entrance is on the level, and there are disabled faclities. In fact people in wheelchairs now attend council meetings.

Groups that do use the town hall don't have to worry about the lack of DDA compliance too much because members of the groups are not wheelchair bound..... and you need to be fit and healthy because any group using the upper floor then the only way out in the event of an emergency is via stairs.

Have you ever wondered why the National Blood Transfusion Service have never used the town hall, even when the Methodist Church was being rebuilt - it's because there is nowhere to park outside to get all the equipment in and out. Perhaps that's why (besides the cost of hire) one of the drama groups has done a runner.

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gazzer
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06/10/2014 : 15:04:43      reply with quote


quote
posted by Rosy Lea

My husband and I attended a Bradford Council Meeting at the TH I think two years ago now and our Mayor refused point blankly to even stand up and address Mr Mallinson, man to man, in a civil manner.

I was at a public meeting at the TH prior to renovations starting and heard Mr Mallinson having a conversation with someone stood next to me in which Mr Mallinson really had a go at our Mayor.(I may still have a recording somewhere). Lets not forget it is Mr Mallinson who has stated that he refuses to work with the Town Council in any capacity and never misses an oppotunity to make life harder for them.
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Rosy Lea
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06/10/2014 : 17:31:47      reply with quote


Peter

Thank you for the background reading.

It was interesting reading but their is no reference to using the downstairs hall. What is wrong with using that? Why does the TC have to be upstairs?
The TH building should be a non political venue and used by all. I hope the present TCís fully support the veto of Tescoís otherwise where do their loyalties lay?

Clearly their has been a lot of dirty water passed under the bridge, but it is time to move forward, with what we are dealt with. If your not in the race you have no chance of winning it, do you?
Our offer of paying for the first usage by the TC in the TH is still open.
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phill
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06/10/2014 : 17:33:10      reply with quote


Just a question Peter, why can't they use the meeting room downstairs, and if they use it on a night our group is in then the door would be open? every night bar Tuesday.
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JeanD
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06/10/2014 : 19:36:58      reply with quote


Just seen where Steeton have a cinema night. Why cant we have one once a month in town hall?
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Pennypeck
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06/10/2014 : 20:20:05      reply with quote


Given Peter's explanation above, I see little reason, if any, for STC not to transfer their meetings to the Town Hall.

First, deviating only slightly, I attend STC main meetings whenever my work commitments permit. There have been one or two references recently to the suitability of the "Coop boardroom" as being both FOC and suitable. In summer perhaps. Perhaps the same in winter for the Councillors at the "business" end of the room but very draughty and very cold for the onlookers at the entrance end. And remember that last year was a mild winter and it was still cold. Secondly, if people have any visions of grandeur by the "boardroom" designation then they have been misled.

1. I have never attended a planning meeting but perceive them to normally be much shorter meetings than the main Council meetings. Acknowledging the obligations with regard to the disabled at the town hall, why not move just the main Council meeting to the town hall? That would bring the monthly fee down to £35.00 per month using Peter's figures, or £420. Given that the room rental is said to be FOC, £420 per annum for a decent place for our Council AND the people they serve is not an unrealistic price to have to pay.

2. If my perception of planning meetings being shorter than main meetings is incorrect, then the full £840 per annum to house both meetings each month is still a realistic price in Council spending terms but perhaps has to be put in the perspective of the Council awarding the gala queen (or committee?) £500 that they hadn't requested to provide a coach and horses for the gala queen this year in respect of the 100th anniversary of the start of the first world war. No objection to the Council's decision on my part, simply putting the amount in perspective. Besides honouring the obligations for the disabled, the Council surely has an obligation for the "well-being" of the other members of the community attending meetings. Of course there is surely no reason why our three Ward Councillors can't enter into a dialogue with BMDC to try and negate or reduce the caretaker's fee.

3. The reasoning above sits above and beyond any situations that might involve bickering between individual Councillors, whether at STC or BMDC level. It is based purely on numbers. Both Councils can hardly threaten never to enter the Town Hall again because they already have done, at the meeting organised by BMDC to advise residents about some of the finer points about the Tour de France. I recall there also being at least one wheelchair present at that upstairs meeting. If the pricing carries the heaviest weighting in any decision, besides the obvious, it would make the Town Hall the main seat of Council business in Silsden, a tradition upheld by the majority of Councils lucky enough to have one and by residents with a traditional view on these matters, of which I would guess there are many in Silsden. Further, it would help raise the profile of the Council AND Silsden, which traditionally increases respect from third parties that in turn can lead to more productive outcomes at the bargaining table.

4. I do not support all the unfair allegations aimed at STC from time to time, often via this website. I prefer to think that the members are seeking to do their best for Silsden, both individually and collectively. Too few decision makers and you can end up with a despot-type administration. Too many and the old adage that says a camel is a horse designed by committee can still ring true. The STC Councillors are not professionals and if you've ever had cause to sit in a meeting full of accountants, lawyers and management consultants you'll thank God that they aren't! However, I believe the bickering involving both the Town Hall, the individuals directly concerned and those supporting the latter has caused ordinary residents of the town (ie the majority) to become "tired" of the bickering over a building that many, dare I say most, are already of the opinion that the refurbished Town Hall surpasses what went before it in most ways. You might note that the highest praise is posted by those who didn't agree with the original plans. Might I suggest that this "tired" situation might be the root cause of the increased negative attitude, by many, against STC.

5. It might help the Council's credibility if responses to STC issues (save for the brief responses in answer to a specific question) that are posted on silsden.net are responded to (say) by the Clerk on behalf of the Council after they have debated it. Instead, it is not uncommon for individual Councillors, with the very best of intentions, to engage in a dialogue that gets them embroiled in a perpetual argument, with the Councillor being made to look like a loose cannon!

Finally, if a fraction of the energy used in trying to maintain the current negative momentum is used in a positive manner, the real gap is so small that it should be easily bridged. I believe that is what many Silsdeners' would prefer. I'll soon get to know if it isn't.

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Rosy Lea
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06/10/2014 : 21:13:51      reply with quote


Brilliantly said PennyPeck!

Raver and I are not alone in our thoughts of a great Silsden to be!
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phill
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06/10/2014 : 21:19:41      reply with quote


this post has been edited 1 time(s)

Agreed.. and if anyone wants to look round informally on a Saturday morning for whatever reason then I am happy to show them all the rooms.
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phill
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06/10/2014 : 21:35:57      reply with quote


Also just heard from a friend who runs Silsden All Stars that they are back training tomorrow at the Town Hall... so anyone who has little ones check out their facebook wall happy :)
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bandnwire
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06/10/2014 : 23:12:05      reply with quote


Pennypeck, you mention that you went to the TDF meeting upstairs at the Town Hall and "there was at least one wheelchair present". I was the only person in a wheelchair present at the meeting, and to make sure that I would be able to attend I had to ring the booking office a few days earlier to state my intention of attending as BMDC state that no more than 2 wheelchair users can be in the upstairs room. I had to wait until another member of the public arrived to open the door as the call button is placed too high and is hidden behind the outer door.
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